From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mail-ej1-x62d.google.com (mail-ej1-x62d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62d]) by mail.toke.dk (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1F22F7C78F1 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2021 18:52:58 +0100 (CET) Authentication-Results: mail.toke.dk; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=broadcom.com header.i=@broadcom.com header.b=RajZ8K3v Received: by mail-ej1-x62d.google.com with SMTP id b9so15745494ejy.0 for ; Fri, 08 Jan 2021 09:52:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=broadcom.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=7m9Akq2HQv8PZ7s8QTO7elXKfoNFr44mS9DR7eAsShQ=; b=RajZ8K3vPop3yY3qwhfPKHan/qZPNDRQUeE0t+LGTQ7oqW+xld5sagQQ+FzkXHiXu5 VbrxxOZfcpKIp+feK86wrKhiVwcmksI84Wrw+ruF95TZcqCllbHUcNDlYBns9FQgjG6W SNB+iT74hmKZvP9bLiBYKk3MQnAKtcrr6w3/4= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=7m9Akq2HQv8PZ7s8QTO7elXKfoNFr44mS9DR7eAsShQ=; b=WTdulN3wx54S5y9FD3o8Z2n3qyBbaTz0CeBocbFCp0vZ3mrM8f1a3b4xINI6Bz3Y3V w7pLBwQ/8o2U/5Ed8f5QfX1TOfnCMo4T4lPYoKDVHki7CdJVr2CQRZlgf8CzCEvVKWm5 D6hhwXYp1ByBp6WKeWkDiFN6ML6zUFniFArzpEvzi9k0899SkvA1EHODx9G9h9Zt0sU8 a7VblKoatCCwrvmRpssZObQOuhb/8iIuu0qI+jc8jEhA369Cd0GHkGE0xco1QtbT8hoK f8KWDvF7dlvHrtf0fY8vke/k9JOZxDCw+1LoQADY1e82zjzEK0cFMQ8V8apfZk7TR2EZ d7tA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533PXDz/al4qoS+ESKdrr/N5RD0radANHsZE8nDwDqkh+s2OX08t 6HXpOTWbTLhYmZKo4dGhh+uASRTocDRoNjRfd99qK733PKKT5hv/lW9swWR+wKJj3MhM5hlohOX h5fzO8DV1bqlJ0Yu0SbPILQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzcDxm09bnhhmBrg/iZfiTvxUEdT6a9w/PDh88W4iRuX+i2FsOou7JDc+JyM7OrUqVotarFrfjkjTWqJSWesdQ= X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:20b5:: with SMTP id pw21mr3584487ejb.494.1610128373396; Fri, 08 Jan 2021 09:52:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202101081435.108EZFvn020544@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <202101081435.108EZFvn020544@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> From: Bob McMahon Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2021 09:52:42 -0800 Message-ID: To: "Rodney W. Grimes" <4bone@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="000000000000c739f205b8673953" X-MailFrom: bob.mcmahon@broadcom.com X-Mailman-Rule-Hits: nonmember-moderation X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation Message-ID-Hash: HDAK5MLTRIC4ZUJ6RXEK6QAJYB6HEXPJ X-Message-ID-Hash: HDAK5MLTRIC4ZUJ6RXEK6QAJYB6HEXPJ X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 08 Jan 2021 20:30:09 +0100 CC: Dave Taht , ghosal@cs.ucdavis.edu, BBR Development , Taran Lynn , Make-Wifi-fast , ECN-Sane , bloat , codel@lists.bufferbloat.net, flent-users X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.2 Precedence: list Subject: [Flent-users] Re: [Ecn-sane] [Make-wifi-fast] D* tcp looks pretty good, on paper List-Id: Flent discussion list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000c739f205b8673953 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000bd90b305b8673993" --000000000000bd90b305b8673993 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" For that run it was two nodes each using 8 core (16 hyperthreads) systems running Fedora 30 each with a spectracom GPS disciplined OCXO over pcie. The two nodes are connected via a single 10G switch with 10G copper. I use this rig as part of iperf 2 development. I haven't published any results with the raspberry pie as the PTP grandmaster. I just want to mention it because most people can't afford the spectracom based systems. We have many runs around WiFi with competitive traffic same stack, air compete, AIFS disadvantaged, etc. All these results are internal use only. Also, a side note and a reminder by Jaffe written in 1981, that flow control power is not decentralizeble per the below . "On the assumption that communication links behave like M/M/1 servers it is shown that no "decentralized flow control algorithm" can maximize network power. Power has been suggested in the literature as a network performance objective. It is also shown that no objective based only on the users' throughputs and average delay is decentralizable. Finally, a restricted class of algorithms cannot even approximate power. Bob On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 6:35 AM Rodney W. Grimes <4bone@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > This is through one of the last remaining cerowrt boxes in the world, > > running fq_codel. tcp-davis takes about a 20% single stream throughput > > hit vs bbr. > > > > I note, that I don't care one whit about throughput anymore. I care > > that nothing, NOTHING messes up my videoconference... > > IMHO it is a fools errand to place all priorty on one of throughput > or delay, but it is reasonable to slightly bias the situation to > defer a bit over throughput if a stable lower delay is gained. The > lost of some throughput can often be made up with additional capacity, > but nothing can increase the speed of light. > > > and thus the tcp-rtt stats attached for davis are pleasing. > > A questions/comment inline below about this data. > > > > > On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 12:26 PM Bob McMahon > wrote: > > > > > > FYI, one can try this out using iperf 2.1 with --trip-times. This > gives end/end delay at the application level. One can use --trip-times when > clocks > > > are sync'd to get the write to read latencies which are the latencies > at the application level. > > > > > > Note: I set up a Raspberry Pi 4 with a GPS hat from ubutronics for > solderless pulse per second. Then configured it as a PTP grandmaster. > This cost me around $200. > > Ok, so that is the clock source node, could we get a better description of > the network topology and end node hardware? > > > > I also added support for a very crude --near-congestion option that > paces the writes based upon the weight of the RTT. The tcp_info struct is > sampled and available > > > for other experiments though one would have to modify the source a > bit. This current technique used by iperf 2.1 is designed for test networks > only where all > > > traffic is under script control. We've had too many people measuring > bloat as latency. We really need separate measurements between the two > phenomena, > > > bloat vs latency, because they require different eng actions for a > semiconductor supplier. > > > > > > Below are examples over a 10G link, first with no write pacing then > with it. The server output, shown first, has the latency data (as well as > the net power > > > and little's law calculation.) (Note: use --histograms for to get > full distributions.) > > Is this network a 3 node physical dumb-bell, or is this in Netem or is > this something more complicated? > What is the inherient delay path of this network? Aka, what is D in the > BDP, given the near saturation and the small window my guess is this is a > simple 3 node dumb bell, but would like confirmation of that. > > > > > > > No write pacing > > > > > > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -s -i 1 -e > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Server listening on TCP port 5001 with pid 24568 > > > Read buffer size: 128 KByte (Dist bin width=16.0 KByte) > > > TCP window size: 85.3 KByte (default) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [ 1] local 192.168.1.10%enp2s0 port 5001 connected with 192.168.1.62 > port 50056 (MSS=1448) (trip-times) (sock=4) (peer 2.1.0-rc) on 2021-01-07 > 12:11:04 (PST) > > > [ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Burst Latency > avg/min/max/stdev (cnt/size) inP NetPwr Reads=Dist > > > [ 1] 0.00-1.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.34 Gbits/sec > 2.959/1.180/3.681/0.388 ms (8905/131072) 3.31 MByte 394522 > 18480=2459:2580:2475:2354:2203:2192:1974:2243 > > > [ 1] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.993/2.302/3.703/0.359 ms (8978/131072) 3.36 MByte 393209 > 19482=2526:2850:3102:2622:2344:2297:1867:1874 > > > [ 1] 2.00-3.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec > 3.010/2.302/3.692/0.347 ms (8978/131085) 3.38 MByte 391047 > 19387=2563:2757:2928:2708:2432:2244:1829:1926 > > > [ 1] 3.00-4.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 3.009/2.301/3.668/0.348 ms (8979/131060) 3.38 MByte 391094 > 18821=2456:2585:2660:2545:2270:2239:1906:2160 > > > [ 1] 4.00-5.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec > 2.985/2.299/3.696/0.359 ms (8979/131070) 3.35 MByte 394295 > 19441=2509:2886:2959:2728:2336:2200:1971:1852 > > > [ 1] 5.00-6.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.977/2.258/3.671/0.363 ms (8978/131082) 3.34 MByte 395352 > 18509=2352:2602:2464:2380:2263:2142:2095:2211 > > > [ 1] 6.00-7.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.980/2.290/3.680/0.363 ms (8978/131072) 3.34 MByte 394873 > 18522=2407:2499:2565:2334:2213:2268:1999:2237 > > > [ 1] 7.00-8.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec > 2.980/2.253/3.702/0.362 ms (8979/131073) 3.35 MByte 394972 > 18615=2427:2592:2493:2460:2281:2057:2062:2243 > > > [ 1] 8.00-9.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.976/2.277/3.663/0.364 ms (8979/131065) 3.34 MByte 395443 > 18632=2338:2615:2647:2351:2192:2317:2063:2109 > > > [ 1] 9.00-10.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.976/2.293/3.690/0.366 ms (8978/131076) 3.34 MByte 395416 > 18428=2281:2622:2497:2275:2178:2253:2129:2193 > > > [ 1] 0.00-10.00 sec 11.0 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 2.984/1.180/3.703/0.362 ms (89736/131072) 3.35 MByte 394014 > 188367=24320:26609:26793:24757:22712:22211:19916:21049 > > > > > > > > > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]src/iperf -c 192.168.1.10 > --trip-times -i 1 -e > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Client connecting to 192.168.1.10, TCP port 5001 with pid 18961 (1 > flows) > > > Write buffer size: 131072 Byte > > > TCP window size: 85.0 KByte (default) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [ 1] local 192.168.1.62%enp2s0 port 50056 connected with 192.168.1.10 > port 5001 (MSS=1448) (trip-times) (sock=3) (ct=0.41 ms) on 2021-01-07 > 12:11:04 (PST) > > > [ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Write/Err Rtry > Cwnd/RTT NetPwr > > > [ 1] 0.00-1.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.37 Gbits/sec 8937/0 0 > 1508K/1099 us 1065750 > > > [ 1] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8975/0 0 > 1508K/1087 us 1082218 > > > [ 1] 2.00-3.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8975/0 0 > 1508K/1081 us 1088225 > > > [ 1] 3.00-4.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec 8984/0 0 > 1508K/1085 us 1085300 > > > [ 1] 4.00-5.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec 8980/0 0 > 1508K/1105 us 1065182 > > > [ 1] 5.00-6.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8975/0 0 > 1582K/1100 us 1069428 > > > [ 1] 6.00-7.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec 8979/0 0 > 1582K/1121 us 1049862 > > > [ 1] 7.00-8.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8976/0 0 > 1582K/1133 us 1038396 > > > [ 1] 8.00-9.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8978/0 0 > 1582K/1115 us 1055394 > > > [ 1] 9.00-10.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.42 Gbits/sec 8986/0 0 > 1582K/1122 us 1049744 > > > [ 1] 0.00-10.00 sec 11.0 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 89748/0 0 > 1582K/1122 us 1048294 > > > > > > > > > With write pacing > > > > > > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -s -i 1 -e > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Server listening on TCP port 5001 with pid 24702 > > > Read buffer size: 128 KByte (Dist bin width=16.0 KByte) > > > TCP window size: 85.3 KByte (default) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [ 1] local 192.168.1.10%enp2s0 port 5001 connected with 192.168.1.62 > port 50072 (MSS=1448) (trip-times) (sock=4) (peer 2.1.0-rc) on 2021-01-07 > 12:14:59 (PST) > > > [ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Burst Latency > avg/min/max/stdev (cnt/size) inP NetPwr Reads=Dist > > > [ 1] 0.00-1.00 sec 1.08 GBytes 9.31 Gbits/sec > 0.401/0.193/2.682/0.168 ms (8876/131084) 456 KByte 2904347 > 19868=3296:2404:2508:2797:3559:1778:1551:1975 > > > [ 1] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 0.400/0.219/0.627/0.053 ms (8971/131071) 460 KByte 2937822 > 19117=3069:2267:2307:2510:3029:1824:1683:2428 > > > [ 1] 2.00-3.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec > 0.374/0.193/0.541/0.055 ms (8958/131060) 428 KByte 3143030 > 18942=2846:2423:2304:2417:2927:1831:1856:2338 > > > [ 1] 3.00-4.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec > 0.385/0.190/0.664/0.070 ms (8952/131072) 441 KByte 3050401 > 19248=3041:2175:2343:2749:3320:1805:1526:2289 > > > [ 1] 4.00-5.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec > 0.380/0.197/0.546/0.057 ms (8965/131075) 436 KByte 3095915 > 19959=3321:2398:2551:2738:3500:1840:1532:2079 > > > [ 1] 5.00-6.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec > 0.369/0.198/0.536/0.051 ms (8956/131072) 423 KByte 3177431 > 21060=3627:2456:2886:3189:4246:1813:1190:1653 > > > [ 1] 6.00-7.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec > 0.380/0.202/0.562/0.054 ms (8959/131077) 436 KByte 3086914 > 19263=3044:2338:2424:2505:3155:1809:1636:2352 > > > [ 1] 7.00-8.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec > 0.376/0.198/0.541/0.053 ms (8965/131061) 432 KByte 3122495 > 19137=3079:2303:2340:2455:3017:1822:1683:2438 > > > [ 1] 8.00-9.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec > 0.381/0.208/0.576/0.054 ms (8974/131073) 438 KByte 3083767 > 19162=3050:2269:2392:2486:3019:1891:1667:2388 > > > [ 1] 9.00-10.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec > 0.371/0.194/0.582/0.057 ms (8964/131070) 425 KByte 3169244 > 19143=3006:2411:2303:2462:3067:1744:1760:2390 > > > [ 1] 0.00-10.00 sec 10.9 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec > 0.382/0.190/2.682/0.076 ms (89544/131072) 437 KByte 3074913 > 194908=31380:23444:24362:26308:32839:18161:16084:22330 > > > > > > > > > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -c 192.168.1.10 > --near-congestion=0.05 --trip-times -i 1 -e > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Client connecting to 192.168.1.10, TCP port 5001 with pid 19320 (1 > flows) > > > Write buffer size: 131072 Byte > > > TCP near-congestion delay weight set to 0.0500 > > > TCP window size: 85.0 KByte (default) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [ 1] local 192.168.1.62%enp2s0 port 50072 connected with 192.168.1.10 > port 5001 (MSS=1448) (trip-times) (sock=3) (ct=0.40 ms) on 2021-01-07 > 12:14:59 (PST) > > > [ ID] Interval Transfer Bandwidth Write/Err Rtry > Cwnd/RTT NetPwr > > > [ 1] 0.00-1.00 sec 1.08 GBytes 9.31 Gbits/sec 8881/0 0 > 1135K/373 us 3120427 > > > [ 1] 1.00-2.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8971/0 0 > 1135K/391 us 3007281 > > > [ 1] 2.00-3.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec 8958/0 0 > 1135K/331 us 3547260 > > > [ 1] 3.00-4.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec 8952/0 0 > 1135K/288 us 4074155 > > > [ 1] 4.00-5.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec 8965/0 0 > 1135K/301 us 3903855 > > > [ 1] 5.00-6.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec 8955/0 0 > 1135K/414 us 2835144 > > > [ 1] 6.00-7.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec 8961/0 0 > 1135K/470 us 2499013 > > > [ 1] 7.00-8.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec 8964/0 0 > 1135K/350 us 3356941 > > > [ 1] 8.00-9.00 sec 1.10 GBytes 9.41 Gbits/sec 8973/0 0 > 1135K/472 us 2491756 > > > [ 1] 9.00-10.00 sec 1.09 GBytes 9.40 Gbits/sec 8964/0 0 > 1135K/402 us 2922710 > > > [ 1] 0.00-10.00 sec 10.9 GBytes 9.39 Gbits/sec 89547/0 0 > 1135K/402 us 2919642 > > > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 11:22 AM Taran Lynn via Make-wifi-fast < > make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: > > >> > > >> The source can be found at https://github.com/lambda-11235/tcp_davis > . > > >> > > >> The code mentioned in the paper can be found under the tag > "arxiv_2020". The current master branch has an additional stable mode that > I was testing out. > > >> > > >> > > >> On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 10:35 AM Dave Taht > wrote: > > >>> > > >>> See: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2012.14996.pdf > > >>> > > >>> Things I really like: > > >>> > > >>> * they used flent > > >>> * Using "variance" as the principal signal. This is essentially one > of > > >>> the great unpublished and unanalyzed improvements on the minstrel > > >>> algorithm as well > > >>> * Conventional ecn response > > >>> * outperforms bbr on variable links > > >>> > > >>> Only negative so far is I haven't found any published source to it. > :( > > >>> > > >>> Otherwise a very promising start to a year. > > >>> > > >>> "The choice of feedback mechanism between delay and packet loss has > > >>> long been a point of contention in TCP congestion control. This has > > >>> partly been resolved, as it has become increasingly evident that > delay > > >>> based methods are needed to facilitate modern interactive web > > >>> applications. However, what has not been resolved is what control > > >>> should be used, with the two candidates being the congestion window > > >>> and the pacing rate. BBR is a new delay based congestion control > > >>> algorithm that uses a pacing rate as its primary control and the > > >>> congestion window as a secondary control. We propose that a > congestion > > >>> window first algorithm might give more desirable performance > > >>> characteristics in situations where latency must be minimized even at > > >>> the expense of some loss in throughput. To evaluate this hypothesis > we > > >>> introduce a new congestion control algorithm called TCP D*, which is > a > > >>> congestion window first algorithm that adopts BBR's approach of > > >>> maximizing delivery rate while minimizing latency. In this paper, we > > >>> discuss the key features of this algorithm, discuss the differences > > >>> and similarity to BBR, and present some preliminary results based on > a > > >>> real implementation." > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over > public > > >>> relations, for Mother Nature cannot be fooled" - Richard Feynman > > >>> > > >>> dave@taht.net CTO, TekLibre, LLC Tel: 1-831-435-0729 > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Make-wifi-fast mailing list > > >> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net > > >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/make-wifi-fast > > > > > > > > > This electronic communication and the information and any files > transmitted with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended > solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and > may contain information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected > by privacy laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If > you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering > the e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, > copying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of > this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error, > please return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and > destroy any printed copy of it. > > > > > > > > -- > > "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public > > relations, for Mother Nature cannot be fooled" - Richard Feynman > > > > dave@taht.net CTO, TekLibre, LLC Tel: 1-831-435-0729 > > [ Attachment, skipping... ] > > [ Attachment, skipping... ] > > [ Attachment, skipping... ] > > [ Attachment, skipping... ] > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ecn-sane mailing list > > Ecn-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net > > https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/ecn-sane > > > -- > Rod Grimes > rgrimes@freebsd.org > -- This electronic communication and the information and any files transmitted with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected by privacy laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. 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For that run it was two nodes each using 8 core (16 hypert= hreads) systems running=C2=A0Fedora 30 each with a spectracom GPS disciplin= ed OCXO over pcie.=C2=A0 The two nodes are connected via a single 10G switc= h with=C2=A010G copper. I use this rig as part of iperf 2 development.=C2= =A0

I haven't published any results with the raspberry pie as th= e PTP grandmaster. I just want to mention it because most people can't = afford the spectracom based systems.

We have many runs around=C2=A0W= iFi with competitive traffic same stack, air compete, AIFS disadvantaged, e= tc.=C2=A0 All these results are internal use only.

Also, a side note= and a reminder by=C2=A0Jaffe written in 1981, that flow control power is not decentralizeble= per the below.=C2=A0

"On the assumption that communicatio= n links behave like M/M/1 servers it is shown that no "decentralized f= low control algorithm"=C2=A0
can maximize network power. Pow= er has been suggested in the literature as a network performance objective.= It is also=C2=A0
shown that no objective based only on the users= ' throughputs and average delay is decentralizable.=C2=A0
Fin= ally, a restricted class of algorithms cannot even approximate power.

Bob

On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 6:35 AM Rodney W. Grimes <<= a href=3D"mailto:4bone@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net">4bone@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> w= rote:
> This = is through one of the last remaining cerowrt boxes in the world,
> running fq_codel. tcp-davis takes about a 20% single stream throughput=
> hit vs bbr.
>
> I note, that I don't care one whit about throughput anymore. I car= e
> that nothing, NOTHING messes up my videoconference...

IMHO it is a fools errand to place all priorty on one of throughput
or delay, but it is reasonable to slightly bias the situation to
defer a bit over throughput if a stable lower delay is gained.=C2=A0 The lost of some throughput can often be made up with additional capacity,
but nothing can increase the speed of light.

> and thus the tcp-rtt stats attached for davis are pleasing.

A questions/comment inline below about this data.

>
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 12:26 PM Bob McMahon <bob.mcmahon@broadcom.com> wr= ote:
> >
> > FYI, one can try this out using iperf 2.1 with --trip-times.=C2= =A0 This gives end/end delay at the application level. One can use --trip-t= imes when clocks
> > are sync'd to get the write to read latencies which are the l= atencies at the application level.
> >
> > Note: I set up a Raspberry Pi 4 with a GPS hat from ubutronics fo= r solderless pulse per second.=C2=A0 Then configured it as a PTP grandmaste= r.=C2=A0 This cost me around $200.

Ok, so that is the clock source node, could we get a better description of = the network topology and end node hardware?

> > I also added support for a very crude --near-congestion option th= at paces the writes based upon the weight of the RTT.=C2=A0 The tcp_info st= ruct is sampled and available
> > for other experiments though one would have to modify the source = a bit. This current technique used by iperf 2.1 is designed for test networ= ks only where all
> > traffic is under script control. We've had too many people me= asuring bloat as latency. We really need separate measurements between the = two phenomena,
> > bloat vs latency, because they require different eng actions for = a semiconductor supplier.
> >
> > Below are examples over a 10G link, first with no write pacing th= en with it. The server output, shown first, has the latency data (as well a= s the net power
> > and little's law calculation.)=C2=A0 (Note: use --histograms = for to get full distributions.)

Is this network a 3 node physical dumb-bell, or is this in Netem or is this= something more complicated?
What is the inherient delay path of this network?=C2=A0 Aka, what is D in t= he BDP, given the near saturation and the small window my guess is this is = a simple 3 node dumb bell, but would like confirmation of that.

> >
> > No write pacing
> >
> > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -s -i 1 -e
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > Server listening on TCP port 5001 with pid 24568
> > Read buffer size:=C2=A0 128 KByte (Dist bin width=3D16.0 KByte) > > TCP window size: 85.3 KByte (default)
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > [=C2=A0 1] local 192.168.1.10%enp2s0 port 5001 connected with 192= .168.1.62 port 50056 (MSS=3D1448) (trip-times) (sock=3D4) (peer 2.1.0-rc) o= n 2021-01-07 12:11:04 (PST)
> > [ ID] Interval=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Transfer=C2=A0 =C2=A0 B= andwidth=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Burst Latency avg/min/max/stdev (cnt/size) inP NetPwr= =C2=A0 Reads=3DDist
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-1.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.34 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.959/1.180/3.681/0.388 ms (8905/131072) 3.31 MByte 394522=C2=A0 184= 80=3D2459:2580:2475:2354:2203:2192:1974:2243
> > [=C2=A0 1] 1.00-2.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.993/2.302/3.703/0.359 ms (8978/131072) 3.36 MByte 393209=C2=A0 194= 82=3D2526:2850:3102:2622:2344:2297:1867:1874
> > [=C2=A0 1] 2.00-3.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 3.010/2.302/3.692/0.347 ms (8978/131085) 3.38 MByte 391047=C2=A0 193= 87=3D2563:2757:2928:2708:2432:2244:1829:1926
> > [=C2=A0 1] 3.00-4.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 3.009/2.301/3.668/0.348 ms (8979/131060) 3.38 MByte 391094=C2=A0 188= 21=3D2456:2585:2660:2545:2270:2239:1906:2160
> > [=C2=A0 1] 4.00-5.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.985/2.299/3.696/0.359 ms (8979/131070) 3.35 MByte 394295=C2=A0 194= 41=3D2509:2886:2959:2728:2336:2200:1971:1852
> > [=C2=A0 1] 5.00-6.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.977/2.258/3.671/0.363 ms (8978/131082) 3.34 MByte 395352=C2=A0 185= 09=3D2352:2602:2464:2380:2263:2142:2095:2211
> > [=C2=A0 1] 6.00-7.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.980/2.290/3.680/0.363 ms (8978/131072) 3.34 MByte 394873=C2=A0 185= 22=3D2407:2499:2565:2334:2213:2268:1999:2237
> > [=C2=A0 1] 7.00-8.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.980/2.253/3.702/0.362 ms (8979/131073) 3.35 MByte 394972=C2=A0 186= 15=3D2427:2592:2493:2460:2281:2057:2062:2243
> > [=C2=A0 1] 8.00-9.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.976/2.277/3.663/0.364 ms (8979/131065) 3.34 MByte 395443=C2=A0 186= 32=3D2338:2615:2647:2351:2192:2317:2063:2109
> > [=C2=A0 1] 9.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.976/2.293/3.690/0.366 ms (8978/131076) 3.34 MByte 395416=C2=A0 184= 28=3D2281:2622:2497:2275:2178:2253:2129:2193
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 11.0 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 2.984/1.180/3.703/0.362 ms (89736/131072) 3.35 MByte 394014=C2=A0 18= 8367=3D24320:26609:26793:24757:22712:22211:19916:21049
> >
> >
> > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]src/iperf -c 192.168.1.10 --trip= -times -i 1 -e
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > Client connecting to 192.168.1.10, TCP port 5001 with pid 18961 (= 1 flows)
> > Write buffer size: 131072 Byte
> > TCP window size: 85.0 KByte (default)
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > [=C2=A0 1] local 192.168.1.62%enp2s0 port 50056 connected with 19= 2.168.1.10 port 5001 (MSS=3D1448) (trip-times) (sock=3D3) (ct=3D0.41 ms) on= 2021-01-07 12:11:04 (PST)
> > [ ID] Interval=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Transfer=C2=A0 =C2=A0 B= andwidth=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Write/Err=C2=A0 Rtry=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= Cwnd/RTT=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 NetPwr
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-1.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.37 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8937/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01508K/= 1099 us=C2=A0 1065750
> > [=C2=A0 1] 1.00-2.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8975/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01508K/= 1087 us=C2=A0 1082218
> > [=C2=A0 1] 2.00-3.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8975/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01508K/= 1081 us=C2=A0 1088225
> > [=C2=A0 1] 3.00-4.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8984/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01508K/= 1085 us=C2=A0 1085300
> > [=C2=A0 1] 4.00-5.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8980/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01508K/= 1105 us=C2=A0 1065182
> > [=C2=A0 1] 5.00-6.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8975/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K/= 1100 us=C2=A0 1069428
> > [=C2=A0 1] 6.00-7.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8979/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K/= 1121 us=C2=A0 1049862
> > [=C2=A0 1] 7.00-8.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8976/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K/= 1133 us=C2=A0 1038396
> > [=C2=A0 1] 8.00-9.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8978/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K/= 1115 us=C2=A0 1055394
> > [=C2=A0 1] 9.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.42 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8986/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K/= 1122 us=C2=A0 1049744
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 11.0 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 89748/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01582K= /1122 us=C2=A0 1048294
> >
> >
> > With write pacing
> >
> > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -s -i 1 -e
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > Server listening on TCP port 5001 with pid 24702
> > Read buffer size:=C2=A0 128 KByte (Dist bin width=3D16.0 KByte) > > TCP window size: 85.3 KByte (default)
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > [=C2=A0 1] local 192.168.1.10%enp2s0 port 5001 connected with 192= .168.1.62 port 50072 (MSS=3D1448) (trip-times) (sock=3D4) (peer 2.1.0-rc) o= n 2021-01-07 12:14:59 (PST)
> > [ ID] Interval=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Transfer=C2=A0 =C2=A0 B= andwidth=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Burst Latency avg/min/max/stdev (cnt/size) inP NetPwr= =C2=A0 Reads=3DDist
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-1.00 sec=C2=A0 1.08 GBytes=C2=A0 9.31 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.401/0.193/2.682/0.168 ms (8876/131084)=C2=A0 456 KByte 2904347=C2= =A0 19868=3D3296:2404:2508:2797:3559:1778:1551:1975
> > [=C2=A0 1] 1.00-2.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.400/0.219/0.627/0.053 ms (8971/131071)=C2=A0 460 KByte 2937822=C2= =A0 19117=3D3069:2267:2307:2510:3029:1824:1683:2428
> > [=C2=A0 1] 2.00-3.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.374/0.193/0.541/0.055 ms (8958/131060)=C2=A0 428 KByte 3143030=C2= =A0 18942=3D2846:2423:2304:2417:2927:1831:1856:2338
> > [=C2=A0 1] 3.00-4.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.385/0.190/0.664/0.070 ms (8952/131072)=C2=A0 441 KByte 3050401=C2= =A0 19248=3D3041:2175:2343:2749:3320:1805:1526:2289
> > [=C2=A0 1] 4.00-5.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.380/0.197/0.546/0.057 ms (8965/131075)=C2=A0 436 KByte 3095915=C2= =A0 19959=3D3321:2398:2551:2738:3500:1840:1532:2079
> > [=C2=A0 1] 5.00-6.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.369/0.198/0.536/0.051 ms (8956/131072)=C2=A0 423 KByte 3177431=C2= =A0 21060=3D3627:2456:2886:3189:4246:1813:1190:1653
> > [=C2=A0 1] 6.00-7.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.380/0.202/0.562/0.054 ms (8959/131077)=C2=A0 436 KByte 3086914=C2= =A0 19263=3D3044:2338:2424:2505:3155:1809:1636:2352
> > [=C2=A0 1] 7.00-8.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.376/0.198/0.541/0.053 ms (8965/131061)=C2=A0 432 KByte 3122495=C2= =A0 19137=3D3079:2303:2340:2455:3017:1822:1683:2438
> > [=C2=A0 1] 8.00-9.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.381/0.208/0.576/0.054 ms (8974/131073)=C2=A0 438 KByte 3083767=C2= =A0 19162=3D3050:2269:2392:2486:3019:1891:1667:2388
> > [=C2=A0 1] 9.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.371/0.194/0.582/0.057 ms (8964/131070)=C2=A0 425 KByte 3169244=C2= =A0 19143=3D3006:2411:2303:2462:3067:1744:1760:2390
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 10.9 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 0.382/0.190/2.682/0.076 ms (89544/131072)=C2=A0 437 KByte 3074913=C2= =A0 194908=3D31380:23444:24362:26308:32839:18161:16084:22330
> >
> >
> > [rjmcmahon@localhost iperf2-code]$ src/iperf -c 192.168.1.10 --ne= ar-congestion=3D0.05 --trip-times -i 1 -e
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > Client connecting to 192.168.1.10, TCP port 5001 with pid 19320 (= 1 flows)
> > Write buffer size: 131072 Byte
> > TCP near-congestion delay weight set to 0.0500
> > TCP window size: 85.0 KByte (default)
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > [=C2=A0 1] local 192.168.1.62%enp2s0 port 50072 connected with 19= 2.168.1.10 port 5001 (MSS=3D1448) (trip-times) (sock=3D3) (ct=3D0.40 ms) on= 2021-01-07 12:14:59 (PST)
> > [ ID] Interval=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Transfer=C2=A0 =C2=A0 B= andwidth=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Write/Err=C2=A0 Rtry=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= Cwnd/RTT=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 NetPwr
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-1.00 sec=C2=A0 1.08 GBytes=C2=A0 9.31 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8881/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 373 us=C2=A0 3120427
> > [=C2=A0 1] 1.00-2.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8971/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 391 us=C2=A0 3007281
> > [=C2=A0 1] 2.00-3.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8958/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 331 us=C2=A0 3547260
> > [=C2=A0 1] 3.00-4.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8952/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 288 us=C2=A0 4074155
> > [=C2=A0 1] 4.00-5.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8965/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 301 us=C2=A0 3903855
> > [=C2=A0 1] 5.00-6.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8955/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 414 us=C2=A0 2835144
> > [=C2=A0 1] 6.00-7.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8961/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 470 us=C2=A0 2499013
> > [=C2=A0 1] 7.00-8.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8964/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 350 us=C2=A0 3356941
> > [=C2=A0 1] 8.00-9.00 sec=C2=A0 1.10 GBytes=C2=A0 9.41 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8973/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 472 us=C2=A0 2491756
> > [=C2=A0 1] 9.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 1.09 GBytes=C2=A0 9.40 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 8964/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K/= 402 us=C2=A0 2922710
> > [=C2=A0 1] 0.00-10.00 sec=C2=A0 10.9 GBytes=C2=A0 9.39 Gbits/sec= =C2=A0 89547/0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 0=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A01135K= /402 us=C2=A0 2919642
> >
> > Bob
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 11:22 AM Taran Lynn via Make-wifi-fast <= ;= make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> The source can be found at https://github.com= /lambda-11235/tcp_davis .
> >>
> >> The code mentioned in the paper can be found under the tag &q= uot;arxiv_2020". The current master branch has an additional stable mo= de that I was testing out.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Jan 7, 2021 at 10:35 AM Dave Taht <dave.taht@gmail.com> wrote= :
> >>>
> >>> See: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2012.14996.pdf<= br> > >>>
> >>> Things I really like:
> >>>
> >>> * they used flent
> >>> * Using "variance" as the principal signal. Thi= s is essentially one of
> >>> the great unpublished and unanalyzed improvements on the = minstrel
> >>> algorithm as well
> >>> * Conventional ecn response
> >>> * outperforms bbr on variable links
> >>>
> >>> Only negative so far is I haven't found any published= source to it. :(
> >>>
> >>> Otherwise a very promising start to a year.
> >>>
> >>> "The choice of feedback mechanism between delay and = packet loss has
> >>> long been a point of contention in TCP congestion control= . This has
> >>> partly been resolved, as it has become increasingly evide= nt that delay
> >>> based methods are needed to facilitate modern interactive= web
> >>> applications. However, what has not been resolved is what= control
> >>> should be used, with the two candidates being the congest= ion window
> >>> and the pacing rate. BBR is a new delay based congestion = control
> >>> algorithm that uses a pacing rate as its primary control = and the
> >>> congestion window as a secondary control. We propose that= a congestion
> >>> window first algorithm might give more desirable performa= nce
> >>> characteristics in situations where latency must be minim= ized even at
> >>> the expense of some loss in throughput. To evaluate this = hypothesis we
> >>> introduce a new congestion control algorithm called TCP D= *, which is a
> >>> congestion window first algorithm that adopts BBR's a= pproach of
> >>> maximizing delivery rate while minimizing latency. In thi= s paper, we
> >>> discuss the key features of this algorithm, discuss the d= ifferences
> >>> and similarity to BBR, and present some preliminary resul= ts based on a
> >>> real implementation."
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> "For a successful technology, reality must take prec= edence over public
> >>> relations, for Mother Nature cannot be fooled" - Ric= hard Feynman
> >>>
> >>> dave@t= aht.net <Dave T?ht> CTO, TekLibre, LLC Tel: 1-831-435-0729
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Make-wifi-fast mailing list
> >> Make-wifi-fast@lists.bufferbloat.net
> >> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/lis= tinfo/make-wifi-fast
> >
> >
> > This electronic communication and the information and any files t= ransmitted with it, or attached to it, are confidential and are intended so= lely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and ma= y contain information that is confidential, legally privileged, protected b= y privacy laws, or otherwise restricted from disclosure to anyone else. If = you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering= the e-mail to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use= , copying, distributing, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of= this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you received this e-mail in error, = please return the e-mail to the sender, delete it from your computer, and d= estroy any printed copy of it.
>
>
>
> --
> "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over p= ublic
> relations, for Mother Nature cannot be fooled" - Richard Feynman<= br> >
> dave@taht.net &= lt;Dave T?ht> CTO, TekLibre, LLC Tel: 1-831-435-0729

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> _______________________________________________
> Ecn-sane mailing list
> Ec= n-sane@lists.bufferbloat.net
> https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/ecn-sane<= /a>
>
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